[Hound Dog Mom]

Congrats on the new pup! 🙂

All the foods you mentioned are great except I would avoid the Kirkland – it’s manufactured by Diamond (poor quality control/frequent recalls). I’d actually recommend rotating between the foods – the earlier you start a rotational diet and get your pup accustomed to a variety of healthy foods the better! 🙂

Grain-free diets are recommended because grains are not a natural component of a dog’s diet. Kibbles containing grains are often (but not always!) lower in animal-derived protein and carry a higher risk of being contaminated with mycotoxins. Many dogs also seem to have food sensitivities with symptoms that subside once they are switched to a grain-free diet. Grains are also inflammatory, contain anti-nutrients (such as lectins) and many (like corn) are often genetically modified. With this said, not all grain-inclusive kibbles are bad. The thing is, a starch component is necessary in kibble. Ideally a dog’s diet would contain no grains or starches but starch is needed to bind the kibble. Starch can be present in the form or grains, legumes, potatoes, tapioca or some combination of these. The thing is, many of the grain-alternative starches carry many of the same negative attributes as grains. For this reason, when feeding a kibble I believe the most important thing to look for is a high level of animal-derived protein – I prefer foods with over 30% protein with over 80% being animal-derived. Two quality grain-inclusive foods are appropriate for large breed puppies that I wouldn’t hesitate to recommend are Dr. Tim’s Kinesis ALS and Annamaet’s Ultra Formula.

[Hound Dog Mom]

Hi Whitney –

Thanks for the tip about Kirkland’s rating change – next time I update the list Kirkland will be removed.

As for the Natural life, with that calorie count it’s too high even with a min level of 1.35%.

[Whitney]

WELCOME!!

[Murphysmom]

Hello All! So glad to have found this forum, lots of great knowledge! We are getting a 8 week old golden retriever puppy this coming Saturday, very excited! Our last golden lived to 15, we lost him 2 years ago. Amazingly enough, it’s a whole new world in the dog food world for us now…We fed Rusty Nutro Max and he lived 15 years, though it seems that isn’t the best food out there.We want to start off on the right foot with this puppy so are trying to make food decisions. I was wondering about Merrick, looks like a great line, but I see it isn’t included at all on your calcium chart Hound Dog Mom (thank you for putting that together!)….So wondering/assuming the calcium levels are too high? The other food I really liked was Earthborn Holistic Meadow Feast, but a worker at a pet store talked me out of it, saying it’s 1st ingredient is sweet potato, rather than a protein source. My hopes for a food are: grain free, meets safe calcium levels for a large breed puppy, and wondering if I should avoid potatoes as they are “yeasty”, our 15 year old always got ear infections, and wondered if it would be helpful to avoid these. Help save me from this vicious dog food circle I am stuck in! I’d love to hear your expert opinions 🙂 We also can’t afford the way hi end foods….

[InkedMarie]

Hi Murphys Mom,
Welcome! I don’t know if Goldens are considered large breeds or not; if they are, I urge you to feed a food from HDM’s list.
You said this: “The other food I really liked was Earthborn Holistic Meadow Feast, but a worker at a pet store talked me out of it, saying it’s 1st ingredient is sweet potato, rather than a protein source.”<~~~~~
A quick google search showed that this is the ingredient list of Meadow Feast….no idea why the store employee said that and you can look at the ingredient list as well, on the bag. This is it:

Earthborn Holistic® Meadow Feast™ Natural Dog Food: Ingredients

Lamb Meal, Peas, Tapioca, Canola Oil (preserved with mixed Tocopherols, a source of Vitamin E), Pea Protein, Pea Fiber, Flaxseed, Natural Flavors, Blueberry Fiber, Cranberry Fiber, Apples, Blueberries, Carrots, Spinach, Cranberries, Salt, Potassium Chloride, Choline Chloride, DL-Methionine, L-Lysine, Taurine, L-Carnitine, Vitamin A Supplement, Vitamin D3 Supplement, Vitamin E Supplement, Zinc Sulfate, L-Ascorbyl-2-Polyphosphate (source of Vitamin C), Ferrous Sulfate, Niacin, Calcium Pantothenate, Riboflavin Supplement, Copper Sulfate, Pyridoxine Hydrochloride, Thiamine Mononitrate, Beta-Carotene, Manganese Sulfate, Zinc Proteinate, Manganese Proteinate, Copper Proteinate, Calcium Iodate, Cobalt Carbonate, Folic Acid, Sodium Selenite, Biotin, Vitamin B12 Supplement, Yucca Schidgera Extract, Rosemary Extract, Dried Lactobacillus Plantarum Fermentation Product, Dried Enterococcus Faecium Fermentation Product, Dried Lactobacillus Casei Fermentation Product, Dried Lactobacillus Acidophilus Fermentation Product.

[Murphysmom]

InkedMarie, I guess I’m getting everything all confused….I can’t keep all the reasons straight as to why one food is good and one is not 🙁 After seeing the ingredient list you posted, I think her reason was that a “meal” protein product is main ingredient as opposed to an actual product such as “turkey” or “deboned chicken”. So her reasoning was that a non-meal product (ie deboned chicken) is better than a meal product. I do understand that reasoning, but I am going CRAZY trying to get a food chosen for our puppy!!!! Yes, I believe Golden Retrievers are considered large breed, will get to @70 pounds and up. I am wanting to stick with a food that is on HDM’s large breed puppy list. As I mentioned, Merrick looked like a great food, but it’s not on HDM’s puppy food list. Any thoughts would be much appreciated!

[InkedMarie]

MurphysMom: you said the worker said the first ingredient is sweet potato; I don’t even see sweet potato in the Meadow Feast, yet alone first in the ingredient list. Regarding meals vs meat, read this: /choosing-dog-food/about-meat-meal/

If Goldens are a large breed, choose a food from HDM’s list. She’s made it easy for large breed puppy owners to choose a food.

[kobe]

Hi HDM and Patty Vaughn,

my berner pup has finally recovered from his diarrhea —i am thinking of switching him to raw food —the stores near me carry
Bravo
Honest Kitchen
Natures Variety
Vital

ARE ANY OF THESE APPROPRIATE FOR A LARGE BREED PUPPY OR SHOULD I STICK TO KIBBLE?

thanks so much,
Kobe’s dad

[InkedMarie]

Kobe’s dad: look at the list of appropriate foods for large breed puppies, right here in this thread, for foods.

FYI, Honest Kitchen is not raw.

[kobe]

if anyone can send me a link or identify what page of these 31 pages to find this list,i would greatly appreciate it!!

kobe’s dad

[InkedMarie]

Why can’t you start at page one and find the list?

[Tigerlily]

Well geesh! That’s not very nice or helpful to someone who is reaching out. Kobe – the list is around page 15. 🙂

[kobe]

thanks so much Tigerlily
OBVIOUSLY,INKED MARIE has much more time to go through 31 pages of comments than the rest of us do!! my condolences to INKEDMARIE-

[Cyndi]

Here is a link to the latest list (I believe). Wasn’t too hard to find, but if you don’t know what you’re looking for, I would imagine it would be…

https://docs.google.com/file/d/0BwApI_dhlbnFTXhUdi1KazFzSUk/edit?pli=1

[InkedMarie]

TigerLily,
As KobesDad said, I do have more time. I do, today, killing half an hour til I have to leave. Since I had time, I scrolled thru this topic.

Kobe’s Dad started posting here on August 9 th. That same day, HDM advised him to scroll back to find the list of appropriate foods. That same day, he said he couldn’t find it & ome one told him the exact page.

The next day, August 10 th, he asked if certain foods were appropriate. The next dy, HDM explained why they were not.

August 17th, he again was told what pages to look at. I stopped there as I have to leave in ten minutes but he has been asking since about foods. He’s not new here, the information has been given to him but, for some reason, he keeps asking about other foods. HDM made a list, it’s available to him. If she updates the list, she’ll tell us.

I my not be nice but sometimes, people have to do some research for themselves, even if its as simple as opening a PDF provided to them.

[Cyndi]

I’m understanding now Marie! I’m not around enough to “enjoy” people like that, lol!

[gsdmommy89]

To InkedMarie

I thought I was the only one that was thinking the same thing about the constant questions and overkill posting. Good to know I’m not the only one

[InkedMarie]

Gsdmommy, no, we’re not the only ones.

[sharfie]

The list is on page 15. It would be nice if it were ea.sier to get to the page but, with effort, it can be done.

[InkedMarie]

HDM did all the work to compile the list; I think we can go through the work to click through the pages to find it, especially when we’ve been told what page number.

[Murphysmom]

Did anyone else have troubles printing the newest version of list on page 15? For some reason, my computer (a mac) won’t print, says ” safari is redirecting” or something similar. anyone else have this?

[Murphysmom]

So, after cramming for “dog food final exam” (also know as bringing puppy home!), I have narrowed down my choices. Puppy is 8 week old golden retriever. wanting to be grain free and obviously concerned about calcium and large breed puppy concerns. I am between Earthborn Holistic (Coastal Catch and Meadow Feast) and Wellness Core Puppy. These are all 5 stars and on the list that HDM so generously has put togerher and shared (THANK YOU SO SO SO MUCH!) I like that Earthborn has 2 choices, so we can rotate foods. I would love thoughts about one versus the other if anyone has them! I am so thankful for the dog food wisdom shared on this site 🙂

[apriliamille]

murphysmom,
i cant remember which forum i read it on but tim hunt (dr tim) had an interesting discussion about “meal” and why he used it and considering iditerod sled dogs use his stuff im sure its valid. i may be wrong in my understanding but pretty much i took it as take a deboned chicken and dehydrate it then prep it for kibble mix then compare it to chicken meal on a protein per weight amount then look at the cost and efforts to put a good protein kibble to market at a value. we use a kibble that has “deboned chicken” as the first ingredient and its definitely hitting the pocket book. (i assume since my dogs are getting a premium chicken breast in their kibble instead of a grocery store for human use)
i think there is quality to “meal” look at some of the ash contents of the kibbles using meal. there are some good numbers out there.
on a side note. i have been transitioning my pup onto meadowfeast to help with the pocket book while i do more research on her food i want to use when she hits 1 year old and i start pushing her physically. i have to feed her on a tray exclusively with the meadowfeast (not saying yours will need to) its a smaller kibble then she has ever had and she has reverted to her younger days of vacuum. also the earthborn UPC for Trees is a neat program they do.

• This reply was modified 11 years, 2 months ago by apriliamille.
• This reply was modified 11 years, 2 months ago by apriliamille. Reason: keep finding i dont make sense in my sentances

[Sully’sMom]

Hi murphy’s mom ~

Welcome and congrats on your new addition! You don’t really have to choose between the Earthborn (which is about to become part of our rotation) or the Wellness. You can rotate between them. And when pup is past 8 months and you don’t have to worry about the calcium levels so much, Earthborn has other varieties you can add in also.

Enjoy,
Sully’s Mom

[theBCnut]

Rotation between brands is important. No dog food is perfect and foods within the same brand are likely to have the same imperfections such as too much of one vitamin and not enough of another, so switching between brands helps to mitigate these imperfections.

[baileydog]

We are bringing home an 8 week old black lab puppy this weekend and are trying to figure out which food to start him on. He is estimated to grow to about 90 lbs and has been eating Purina Pro Plan Sport. We also have an 11.5 year old chocolate lab (70 lbs) who has been eating Natural Balance Sweet Potato & Venison for a few years. I would love to be able to have both dogs eating the same (better!) food if possible and we would switch our older dog to the better brand. Our older dog has really slowed down, has had ACL surgeries, has arthritis and is prone to yeast growth in her ears. She has allergies, but I think they are more seasonal, to grasses and such (itchy skin, licks her paws) since they flare in the spring.

After reading through most of this thread, do you think it’d be okay to put both labs on Earthborn or Fromm?

[theBCnut]

Earthborn Meadow Feast is a great food and appropriate for large breed growth, so is Coastal Catch.

[Anonymous]

Hi Pattyvaughn and Hound Dog Mom – I just wanted to let you know that so far your advice has really helped our 3 month old golden. We have him on Earthborn Coastal Catch, with a dollop of pumpkin and about 1/3 of a digestive enzyme pill in each of his 3 meals, and about 1/3 of a probiotic capsule’s contents once daily, plus a frozen Kong of Earthborn’s chicked based wet food to distract him while we eat our dinner. His stools have really firmed up, so now we can focus on puppy mischief rather than worrying about health problems! Thanks so much!
Murphysmom- I chose the coastal catch over meadow feast because the calorie count and protein content are higher, so I feel like I’m getting a bit more bang for my buck, but I know some people have concerns about mercury and other contaminants in fish-based foods, so that might support a decision to rotate or stick with a different protein source. Good luck and congrats!

[Whitney]

I have had trouble too with printing from my Mac. I can’t at all. So it must be a Mac thing.

[Whitney]

Oh and can someone please tell me why Simply Nourish Grain Free isn’t on here?

[theBCnut]

HDM attempted to contact every company with a 4 or 5 star food. If your 4 or 5 star food of choice didn’t make the list, it is because A) they didn’t get back to her or B) their calcium levels were too high or C) they got back to her but they didn’t answer her request for actual or average calcium level. A lot of companies don’t care if they don’t answer your questions and a lot of companies have too high calcium. HDM did not make seperate lists for each possibility. Just be aware that any food that didn’t make the list is either too high in calcium or the company didn’t care about serving potential customers. That alone is enough for me to not buy the food.

[Anonymous]

Thanks for this wonderful thread, most of all Hound Dog Mom for her great knowledge, research, and unbiased advice.
I have brought home a puppy from the rescue, it looks to be a lab/greyhound mix, it might become large, it might turn out to be medium, but I opted for the safe bet and I am feeding it low calcium.
I have recently moved to America from the Netherlands, and fed my GSD raw, but over there I can go to the butchers and get cuts and special dog-food easily. Here I have to find out anew where to go and what to buy. But I am impressed with the many different brands of quality dog food.
And tripe in a can! Brilliant!

I have learnt so much on this thread! I have read everything and printed HDM’s list so I have no questions, just:
Thank you all very much! Especially Hound Dog Mum.

[apriliamille]

antar.
not intending to de rail the thread. but pending on where you moved to in the usa. look up game and live stock butchers and lockers. we have one here in utah who grinds up the remnants from the deer and elk and sells it as a dog raw for .89 a pound. 2nd shop grinds up and includes the organs and bones for about 1.50 pound

[Anonymous]

I’m in Dallas Texas, there is a company here named ”Texas Tripe” They seem to drop off orders at specific points, I want to try them, but I don’t have my own car yet. And we’re moving in two weeks, so I am going to have to wait a few weeks to really get going.
I will follow up on your tip.
Meanwhile I feel good about the quality kibble and toppers I have been able to find. I think Antar got his first ”meaty bone” ever today, he was amazed, overjoyed, and went to work yelping and ”singing”!!!!

[gsdmommy89]

Hi there everyone. I know this is a puppy thread, and I do have a GSD puppy ( with monstrous paws so I knew he’ll be large!), but I do have a question that maybe someone here could answer. Aside from my puppy, I also have his mom, a 3 yr old GSD. She’s been eating the Earthborn Coastal Catch, but I can’t seem to get her to put weight on. During gestation and nursing, I fed her Earthborn Puppy Vantage. She used to be around 68 lbs. I weighed her yesterday she’s down to 59 lbs. I spoke to my vet, which also monitored her during pregnancy, and she told me that maybe I need to try something with grains in it. She’s been fed a grain free diet pretty much all her life, except when I fed her the Puppy Vantage. The vet told me she’s probably just taking longer to recover from nursing, as she didn’t find anything abnormal. She also told me to try adding Missing Link, to add vitamins or something like that. My dog isn’t bony, but you can tell she is underweight. I was thinking of switching both my GSD’s to Fromm Large Breed puppy. Maybe the puppy formula has more calories and fat so she can gain her weight back? I don’t know. If anyone can give me some advice, I’d really appreciate it. Food? Supplements? Thanks a million!

[Anonymous]

Apriliamille, I have found a game butcher fairly close by, I will definitely try them for dog raw. Thank you so much for this excellent tip!

[apriliamille]

wow netherlands to dallas, texas bet that is a scenery change. nothing quite like saying welcome to usa outside of plopping into texas. start a thread in the raw section to help with locations and ideas for looking for raw for where you are moving to.

gsdmommy89, are you looking for one food for both the adult and the pup?

• This reply was modified 11 years, 2 months ago by apriliamille.

[Anonymous]

apriliamille, It’s the temperatures which are killing me! My GSD was having trouble too, but she was old too. My horse is Arabian and has no problems at all.
Will ask for help in raw section. I am learning a lot, reading my way through the forum…

[gsdmommy89]

I would like for both to be on the same food, so I was thinking switching my adult GSD to puppy food ( they are both currently on Earthborn Coastal Catch) such as Fromm Large Breed puppy.

[Anonymous]

Use Hound Dog Mom’s list from this thread, almost all foods are ”All life stages” anyway, so perfect for your situation. Actually I think there are only two or three puppy foods on that list, due to most puppy foods containing too high percentages of calcium for large breed puppies.

[gsdmommy89]

I’ve read her list and have been following this thread for a while now, so I know about the calcium levels ( that’s why I’ve been feeding the puppy the Earthborn Coastal Catch formula). But my question is about my adult GSD. I’m trying to get her to put her weight back on. Should I put her on puppy food to help her recover her weight? ( of course, I’d go with one on HDM’s list).

[Anonymous]

Have you tried adding fats like coconut oil?

[gsdmommy89]

I haven’t actually. I didn’t know that it was a fat. I thought coconut oil was for digestion. But if you think it’ll work, I’ll definitely try it 🙂

[Sara10010]

I’m new to the forum and am hoping I might be able to get some advice. My husband and I have a five and a half month old Cardigan Welsh Corgi who is showing signs of pano/elbow dysplasia. We had x-rays taken and there is significant space between his elbow joints (right side is worse). We aren’t sure if this is something he might grow out of or if it is, in fact, dysplasia (we are seeing a specialist this weekend). However, we’ve been feeding him Orijen puppy since we brought him home and I’m concerned the protein content might be too much for him and could be contributing to this. It’s undoubtedly a high quality food and he is growing fast on it. I don’t want the vet to put him on a prescription diet as I don’t believe they are nutritious. From reading this thread, it seems that Wellness Core Puppy might be a good option for us? I am also not sure if we should just switch him to an all life stages food at this point? I would love any recommendations that anyone might have – we want to do right by our little guy and I really thought I was giving him the best with Orijen.

Thanks!

[Duke The Boxer]

^^ to sara i had my puppy on welness core and he enjoyed the food a lot and his coat was always very nice and soft. I recently just finished the bag so i rotated to the nature’s variety rabbit meal and my boy loves it even more! He absolutely devours all the food and his stools have been very good. Im no expert but id say start giving your guy some coconut oil supplements and maybe look into a turmeric supplement. Maybe HDM can further chime in

[Anonymous]

I’m lost!! I just brought home my roommate’s, grandson’s 7 yr old staffordshire bull terrier. I know I want a high quality food that is 100% USA made. I’ve been researching everything (Blue, TOTW, 4 Health, etc). He was eating >iamond alternated with purina. I don’t like the diamond recall of 2012…it didn’t affect Max’s previous state but it did affect mine. I realize he isn’t a large breed but he isn’t a small one either. Since he is already use to a some what quality of food I want to started asap.any suggestions I’m brain dead from reading endless reviews and I’m no closer to knowing what would be the best for Max. He does need to lose about 5 to 10 lbs. I have never done anything like this so please bare with me.

[apriliamille]

dana629

start with hound dog mom’s spread sheet and find something that you might like

https://docs.google.com/file/d/0BwApI_dhlbnFTXhUdi1KazFzSUk/edit

[Anonymous]

Thank you so much. I know I was in the wrong place but that was the only one that looked to be active.

[apriliamille]

dana629
for what it’s worth. Dr tim hunt (dr tim’s) made a post in another forum:
Did you know that a large breed dog has calcium/phosp needs that are acceptable for a yorkie, but if use what is acceptable for a yorkie it could be too high for a large breed dog
technically you cant go wrong selecting from that list in the prior post as they are good for large breed
use petflow or chewy if you see something you like that you cant get local

• This reply was modified 11 years, 2 months ago by apriliamille.

[Sara10010]

Thanks, all. I’ve been perusing the spreadsheet and am making a list of options! Regarding the coconut oil, does anyone have tips on how much to give? Do you use white or whole pressed?

[Author]

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