[Joseph w]

I have a 4 year old bull terrier names Bodger. He is normally 65lbs but the last year he shot up to 72lbs. We lowered his food intake to 1 cup a day but he wasn’t losing any weight so we took him in for a blood test thinking he had a thyroid issue but it turned out negative and we suspect he has iiatrogenic Cushing’s from off and in use of prednisone for use with his skin issues. Now that we can no longer use prednisone we are trying to figure out a good diet for him. We use to use homemade raw which possibly worked better than what we have him on now but if it did it was slight. Before raw his normal food was Arcana or Orijen. It is now Avaderm which is the best he’s had since raw but we are no longer able to afford raw. One if his main skin problems is yeast infections on his feet constantly, ears somewhat often and around his anus sometimes and very rarely around mouth and eyes. I need a non yeast/starch/sugar/grain/ low carb kibble, with probiotics Which I plan in supplementing with a whole slew of home remedies and iver the counter products I’ve been researching. I was looking at wellness Tru food and it meets almost all the criteria except has about 40% carbs. Any ideas?

[Susan]

Hi Joseph, have a look at “Canidae” Pure Formulas, Pure Sea is suppose to be excellent for dogs with skin problems… http://www.canidae.com/dog-food/products
also Baths are a must, twice a week, I use Malaseb Medicated Shampoo on my yeasty, itchy, red paws boy but since he’s been eating “Taste Of The Wild” Sierra Mountain Roasted Lamb & a cooked meal for dinner, he hasn’t smelt or itch over 6 months now, but I still bath him every fortnight…. I have finally worked out what foods he’s sensitive too & don’t feed those ingredients no more…..
For dinner Patch gets, Lean Beef Rissole with broccoli, kale, parsley, Flax & Almond Meal, Turmeric powder & a whisked egg, all blended in a blender then mixed thru the lean beef mince & made into 1 cup size rissoles & baked in the oven, cool then freeze….I also boil peeled & cut up sweet potato, then cool & freeze in sections… I take out 1 rissole & a piece of sweet potato for Patches dinner, I sometimes use lean pork mince instead of the Beef Mince… I also give apple pieces as a treat, yogurt thats sugar & fat free, raw almonds 3-4 Almonds a day as a treat.. Follow Rodney Habib on Face Book he just posted a raw/cooked balanced recipe made by Dr Karen Becker & Steve Brown..

[aimee]

Hi Joseph,

The amount of carbs, grains, sugars, etc in the diet have nothing to do with yeast growth on skin. If your dog has a food hypersensitivity reaction (allergy) to an ingredient in the diet the adverse reaction can alter the skin and allow yeast to grow.

You can find good information about yeast on skin here http://www.healthyskin4dogs.com/blog/2015/9/8/facts-myths-about-yeast-dermatitis-in-dogs

[Joseph w]

Aimee, that it is not accurate, sugars starches, carbs has much to do with yeast in the skin

[Joseph w]

Speaking from personal experience and many, many, articles and vets and forums, I think much from that link rubbish. if u want I could post link after link. Diet is the first and foremost important thing in ci trolling yeast out breaks. Once they have the yeast out break you need to control it topically but diet will prevent it from coming back.

[Joseph w]

I finished reading that, I can’t believe how much garbage she’s spewing. I would much rather listen to the hundreds of dog owners who have had amazing results from coconut oil ACV, probiotics, and a low sugar/carb/starch diet than one vet who says it can’t be proven by science. The proof is in the results.

[pitlove]

Hi Joseph-

You may disagree with Aimee and with the article she linked, but the information she presented to you is 100% correct. We now know that Malassezia Yeast is indeed NOT fed by carbs as once believed. The only role diet plays in the control of yeast is when a food allergy is involved.

When a food allergy is present, the immune system is weakened and allows the once controlled population of yeast naturally found on the skin, to overpopulate and thus causes a yeast infection. The key to controlling yeast is to remove the allergen trigger from the diet and therefore strengthen the immune system allowing it to do its job; controlling the yeast.

I was once like you and firmly believed that the only way I could control my dogs cronic yeast infections was by limiting or removing carbs from the diet. Once I started reviewing clinical research and discussing the subject with my vet, I realized how wrong I was and why nothing I tried was working. My dog eats a grain inclusive dry kibble with about 40% carbs and is yeast free, with the exception of the summer months when his environmental allergies flare up.

Edit: Also if you believe your dog has a food allergy you will want to do an elimination trial, also called a food trial to diagnois and confirm it. Discuss how this is done with your vet.

[aimee]

Hi Joseph,

I have no doubt that you could post link after link claiming that the carbohydrate level in the diet influences yeast growth on the skin, but none of your links would be to articles authored by board certified veterinary dermatologists, human dermatologists or be from published peer reviewed journals. The reason for that is because there is no link between dietary carbohydrate levels and yeast infection on the skin in people or dogs. There is a lot of misinformation on the web and unfortunately some of it is spread by people who should know better.

I understand that testimonials are compelling, bloodletting used to be the cutting edge of medicine based on the observation that “it worked”. But things that appear to work, when tested can be found not only not “to work” but to cause harm.

You came here asking for help because what you have been doing isn’t working. Be open to new information that takes you in a different direction. Malassezia is secondary to things like environmental allergies, adverse food reactions (allergy), hormonal disorders, immune suppression, parasites… focus on finding and treating the primary cause. In the mean time bathing with an effective shampoo can help your pet immensely.

Best Wishes

[Joseph w]

I will respectfully disagree. I am completley open minded though and continue to read on the subject. I want my dog to get well and if that means everything I learned and I’m wrong so be it but I really, really dont believe this. I’ve talked to many professionals- IMS and dermatoligists, read many articles and most importantly talked to many, many knowlegable pet owners who have gone through years of trial and error with yeast problems and have tried for instance to removee starch, or grains or sugars or just use ACV or just probiotics, or just coconut oil, and weeks later a years long horrible problem are gone. I’m sure placebo effect right? The people I’ve talked to, myself included aren’t someone who just reads an article or talks to one person and takes it for gospel. There’s so much more supporting what I believe than what you say. What matters more, that there has been a limited number of scientific studys with incliclusive results and something hasn’t been scientifically proven or its reversed effects for thousands if dog owners who live and care for their pets and with them every second if the day and seen there lives change because of these cures. I’m getting wysong starch free kibble and a probiotic supplement for internal and outwardly using ACV and coconut oil and I firmly believe that in 3 months Bodger will be doing wonderful.

[Joseph w]

Let me give u a couple examples why an article from a board certified veterinary dermatologists means absolutely nothing g to me when Uve talks to let owners who have been dealing with their dig for years and found these cures to work. Recently I went to a urologist, I got a referal from my primary because I needed a specialist. I had done probably my 3 days of research on the matter and when I was examined it was obvious I knew much much .it’s about my disease than this so called specialist who had gone to med school for 8 years. Not because he wasn’t smart but because it was my body, and I had Adamantly pursued what was wrong, what medicine I needed and what should be done from all types of sources. I then found the best specialist in the state and after speaking g with him I got another referal. Example 2- I am a computer networker I recently ran into a complex problem with my personal computer that I dint know how to fix right away. Someone who had researched this exact problem from multiple sources for 2 days could have figured out the problem- does this mean they know more than me after years of school? Example 3- The last couple months we’ve been thinking bodger had a thyroid issue and took him in to get a blood test. It turned out negative and the vet thought it was cushings disease which I’d never heard of. Before his LDDS test iiterally research for prob 6 a day for a week- forums, fb groups, Yahoo groups- (the majority of these people are pet owners who are extremely knowledgeable on the subject and have been dealing with this stuff for over a decade and probably more knowledgeable than most vets.) I read articles of all shapes and sizes, punished reports and journals, called the o my place in the country that does a pituitary tumor operation and talked to one of the best IMS on my side of the state. Anyway needless to say after a week I knew much .ore on the subject than my vet when we had his test and it came back negative she just said “ohp he’s all better nothing wrong with him” I believe it was a unique type of Cushing’s and have an appt with a ISP. Point is because your knowlegable In A subject and do it for a living In No way means your right or even have the faintest I would in a heartbeat give pet owners who have lived this day In and day out for years with their loved one just like I did when I spoke with people whos own body it was. But like I said I whole heardjust disagree but will continue ue to research what you said. I’m going g to call my IMS and the u iveristy who does the operation and a very good dermatoligist in a nearby city who I’ve already spoken with on Monday and I will post here what they say. We are also doing a skin allergy test next month and I have no knowledge of those but I was told by one person a forum they can be unreliable and when I was checking out different pet foods around town today I went to local co-op and talked to a lady who worked there who has had terrible yeast problems with her dog for years. She told me she’s spent thousands and different vets and IMS and nothing worked and she has tried dozens of foods doing tests trying g to find out what he was allergic to and the test they did to find out what he was allergic to turned out to be garbage. I kinda had 2 points there- I talked to 2 people who said the allergy tests didn’t work and 1 person who said the test of Ingredients trial and error didn’t work-study this by no means means anything though- just one person’s experience. Anyway after everything she tried she stu k with avaderm for the last couple years, a. Couple months ago she bought pre/pro biotics supplement to add to the food and within 2weeks there was a noticeable difference and within 6weeks he was perfect. Nothing changed except the addition of the final enzymes. In Case ur wondering she wasn’t trying to sell me anything – they didn’t sell the supplement there she was just telling g me her story. Anyway Im done rangting, I. Exhausted and I hope u can read this as my auto correct is going nuts. Have a good evening and I will report back.

[pitlove]

Hi Joseph-

Consider for a moment that if you yourself have never heard of a well known disease like Cushings, that you may not “know everything” and have more to learn.

[anonymously]

I have a dog with allergies, I tried everything, diet changes, listening to homeopathic vets, gobbledygook remedies. Going back and forth to the regular vet.
After a year of this foolishness, I went to a veterinary dermatologist, I spent a few bucks for testing, but within an hour of the evaluation I received a diagnosis and a treatment plan for my dog. She responded to the recommended therapy.
She has been stable ever since (5 years). Allergies don’t go away, they wax and wane. This makes it very difficult, if not impossible, to determine what is working and what is not.

Sometimes it is true, you get what you pay for.

[anonymously]

http://skeptvet.com/Blog/?s=allergies
Science Based Veterinary Medicine

Hope this helps

PS: Nothing is being sold at that site, no supplements, no books, nothing.

[HoundMusic]

The amount of carbs, grains, sugars, etc in the diet have nothing to do with yeast growth on skin. If your dog has a food hypersensitivity reaction (allergy) to an ingredient in the diet the adverse reaction can alter the skin and allow yeast to grow.

That is absolutely untrue. Yeast feeds off simple sugars and certain types of complex carbohydrates, and an overgrowth will often take the form of a skin rash.

[InkedMarie]

For the OP, if you’re still reading, I have experience with yeast with one dog.
The only thing that ultimately worked was a raw diet with no produce. What kind of raw were you feeding? If you were feeding a premade raw, they looking at buying grinds from Hare Today, Raw Feeding Miami, My Pet Carnivore, Reel Raw…..you can also do raw from the grocery store (meat/bone/organ)

[aimee]

Hi Joseph,

I’m glad to hear that you are willing to continue to learn. When you posted that you thought the authors of the link I referred you to were spewing garbage it didn’t seem to me that you were willing to consider what they had said could be true.

I don’t disagree that by researching a focused topic you can become well educated on that subject. The key is to make sure that the sources you are using are credible. It is easy to get lead astray. I use Pub med and google scholar when I first start researching a new topic.

I’d encourage you to spend some of your hours researching Malassezia reading clinical microbiology journals. Through reading those I learned that this isn’t a sugar loving yeast, as is say Candida, it is a fat loving yeast (lipophilic). For the most part it is a fat dependent yeast, meaning that it requires fat to grow. Most strains of Malassezia pachydermatis, the yeast type most often found on dogs, are not lipid dependent but some are and other lipid dependent Malassezia species have been found on dogs. The organism thrives on fats not carbs.

Houndmusic: Besides the fact that Malassezia is a fat loving yeast. The other big hole in the “carbohydrates feed yeast” mantra is that the skin is a long way away from the gut. A high carb diet will directly provide substrate for intestinal yeast to munch on if one suffers from intestinal yeast overgrowth, but on the skin???… I don’t think so.

To get carb from the gut to the skin it has to travel and the means of transport is blood. Glucose levels in the blood are tightly regulated, unless you are a diabetic. Remove all carbs from the diet and your blood glucose isn’t going to be that different from that found when eating a carb inclusive diet. In other words, a similar amount of glucose is transported to the skin on a daily basis regardless of diet.

The final problem for me is how would glucose even get to the outermost surface of the skin on a dog which is where the yeast resides? N/P in people as glucose is a component of sweat… but dogs don’t sweat, except for paw pads and nose and sebum doesn’t have any appreciable glucose in it. Hmmm Housten we have a problem…

See how this whole idea that dietary carbs feed yeast falls apart? The organism prefers and thrives with fats not carbs and I can’t come up with a mechanism that puts carbs on the outermost surface of the skin of a dog much less one in which a high carb diet would deposit higher levels of carb on the skin than a low carb diet.

But I’m open to hearing the other side. Explain to me how eating a high carb diet results in a high level of carbs on the surface of the skin leading to an overgrowth of yeast. I don’t see it. What I do see is a lipid loving organism feeding on the sebum of skin altered from a primary cause.

[Linda H]

Thank you Joseph for your contributions. I do think sugars/carbs cause candidiasis in people.

[Author]

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