[mydogisme]

I was able to put pictures of Dixie on Facebook under my name, Brenda Miller. Still can’t figure out how to do it here. I’m avoiding the day and I know I have to go and get my baby. Can’t stand the thought she won’t be with me any more. I just want to hold her 1 more time and kiss her little nose 1 more time, I want my baby back

[Cyndi]

Patty, I absolutely agree. I don’t have much experience with the Border Collie breed, but Bailey is a mix of Border Collie and Pit bull and she is just the sweetest, most lovable dog ever. I can tell how thankful she is to me for adopting her. She has such a goofball personality and makes me laugh and makes me so very thankful I did decide to adopt another dog.

mydogisme, I had Moose cremated and he is on my dresser along with my favorite picture of him. I “talk” to him often and tell him how much I miss him. I completely understand your feelings. Hang in there…

[Cyndi]

Hi everyone!! 🙂 I have a question…. So, Bailey is doing really well on the raw since her “episode” last week. She only had diarehha & threw up that one day. I have been slowly introducing bones back into her diet. I went thru 2 1/2 lb thing of chicken grind from Hare Today over the course of a couple days with boneless skinless chicken added to it. Just started giving her chicken feet yesterday and today I gave her a little bit of ground beef with her dinner which also included a boneless, skinless chicken thigh, a chicken foot and a chicken leg and some yogurt. My question is, although she’s not necessarily a “gulper”, she hasn’t been really chewing the chicken feet, or the leg she had tonight, all that much. She does chew it and crunches up the bones a few times, but then it seems like she more or less swallows it whole. Is this ok for her to do? Or should I start cutting up her RMB’s in pieces. She doesn’t act like she’s going to choke at all, but I can tell it takes a big effort on her part to swallow whatever it is. Any help, as usual, will most certainly be appreciated.

[Hound Dog Mom]

Hi Cyndi –

I don’t ever recommend cutting up RMBs unless the dog is very small – this just makes the dog even more likely to gulp. Some larger dogs don’t chew small RMBs such as chicken necks and feet and for this reason it’s better to feed them larger RMBs only so they are forced to chew (i.e. turkey necks, chicken backs, etc.). Only crunching a few times is normal – dogs don’t finely chew their food like people do. As long as she’s not swallowing things whole I wouldn’t be concerned. If you scroll down through the raw food topics there’s a thread called “Eating Raw Meaty Bones” that I started. In the thread I have two videos posted (near the end) of one of my dogs eating RMBs so newbies can get an idea of what’s normal – check those out.

• This reply was modified 11 years, 6 months ago by Hound Dog Mom.

[Cyndi]

Awesome, ok, thanks HDM, very much! I do remember watching a while ago 2 videos you had posted. I’ll have to go back and watch again. I thought they were very interesting, especially with 2 of your dogs providing the “sound effects” in the backround. They sounded so pathetic! Lol!

Anyways, I guess I’ll just stay away from the smaller rmb’s then and just feed the larger ones. I’m just so glad Bailey is doing better and loving everything she’s eating. I was so worried about starting to feed her raw that it took me so long to finally do it. So glad I finally did! Thanks for all your help!

[Cyndi]

Good Morning Everyone! 🙂 I have more questions…

I would like to know if anyone can tell me how fast diarrehea can happen if a food doesn’t agree with a dog? I have been having problems with with Bailey with runny stools, off and on for about a week. She’ll do great for a few days, have small hard poops, then all of a sudden have very runny poop for a few days. I have every meal written down what she’s been eating since we started raw on May 5, and I keep going over it trying to figure it out. She was doing great, then had runny poop, went back to 2 or 3 hard poops, gave her a turkey neck last night for dinner (for the first time), she had a hard poop this morning, ate breakfast, then watery poop on our walk about an hour later. I am getting really frustrated and almost thinking of going back to just the Deli Fresh and Nature’s Variety Instinct kibble that she was on before I switched to raw. If it wasn’t for her looking better, shinier coat, brighter eyes, more playful, etc., I probably would have already….

Any help or opinions would be greatly appreciated!!

[Hound Dog Mom]

Hi Cyndi –

How watery is her poop? Like complete liquid or just on the soft side? In my experience the amount of fat, organ meat, muscle meat and bone all affect the “hardness” and color of the stool. For example, if I feed my dogs a pork neck for a meal (high bone) their poop will be very light in color and powdery. If they get a meal high in organ meat their stool will be very dark. A meal high in fat will make their stool on the soft side (kind of like soft serve ice cream as opposed to the hard “pellets” they normally) have. If the stool is very watery (like explosive diarrhea) she’s probably eating something that doesn’t agree with her and/or getting too much fat. If it’s just on the soft side but still formed (like soft serve ice cream) I wouldn’t worry about it as long as it doesn’t persist more than a day or two. When dogs are eating a varied diet, their stools will tend to vary as well. And as far as how long after eating something diarrhea could happen, I’d say most likely the first or second stool she passes after eating a food would be when it would hit.

[Cyndi]

For a few days this week, her poop was just very soft. Last night it was a bit on the harder side. First poop this morning was hard, then about an hour after breakfast it was complete liquid. I know she’s eating grass outside, but other than that nothing has changed except for the turkey neck for the first time last night. Last week when the very soft poop started, I had given her a very small amount of chicken gizzards. So I didn’t feed that again, just her normal stuff. I have been watching the amount of skin on the chicken (I take alot of it off) and she hasn’t had anything else out of the ordinary lately. Should I maybe give her a few RMB’s for meals for the next couple meals? I have been giving her pumpkin and probiotics with meals since the diarrehha (I wish I could spell that word, lol!) started.

[Cyndi]

Well, I am going to be taking Bailey to the vet & I guess I’m going to take her off raw and go back to what she did well on without having diarehhea all the time. I knew I wasn’t going to be able to handle doing the raw thing. I have no idea what I’m doing wrong & I don’t know what else to do.

Bye everyone & thanks for your help. I hope you all have a nice holiday.

[InkedMarie]

It takes time to figure out how much boneless and bony to give each dog.

[Hound Dog Mom]

Hi Cyndi –

I’m sorry you’re having such difficulties. 🙁

I wish I could be of more help but I’m really out of suggestions. I’ve never experienced such a thing with any of my dogs – all three of mine had no issues transitioning cold turkey to a raw diet. I guess I’ve just been lucky because every dog I’ve ever owned has been able to eat whatever I feed them – whether it’s a bowl of Beneful or a balanced homemade raw meal – with no issues. I’m always amazed every time I visit DFA at the numbers of dogs that can eat this, can’t eat that, get diarrhea from this, have allergies to that, etc. etc. I’ve just never experienced such things with my dogs..

[Cyndi]

Thanks HDM! I’m really, really frustrated, because I don’t want to go back to feeding her kibble instead of raw. Do you have any suggestions? Maybe ride it out a few more days? Give her a few straight meals with alot of bone? I mean, she is acting totally fine, except for the loose stools. She only had one bm today, and it WAS better than yesterdays, and I fasted her tonight. I have been feeding her enough bone meals. Dinner is when she gets her RMB’s and I’ve never skipped a bone meal. That’s why I just can’t figure it out. Do you have any suggestions or do you think maybe some dogs just can’t handle a raw diet? I totally value your opinion and would appreciate any suggestions you might have.

An afterthought, I have been wondering if maybe she’s eating something in the yard that she shouldn’t. She is out there alot during the day. She loves to just sit and watch the goings on around her and I hate to keep her couped up in the house when it’s so nice, I just can’t watch her every second though….

[Cyndi]

I know you said you were out of suggestions &I apologize for sounding so desperate. But, anything you could suggest might help. You have alot more experience than I do & I just dont know what else to do, but I dont want to do the wrong thing. If you suggest that the best thing to do would probably be go back to kibble, then I would probably end up doing that…

[lassiebaby]

can you please help ? how to post a new message and add profile picture. Thank you.

[Hound Dog Mom]

I can imagine how frustrated you must be! If it were me, assuming the stools aren’t completely liquid diarrhea and you really want to make a raw diet work, I would ride it out awhile longer. Some dogs just take longer to adjust to changes in diet. Although I don’t feel it’s common, a raw diet just may not be right for some dogs. Do you have her on a probiotic supplement? (I’m almost certain this has been discussed already, but I thought I’d check just in case). If not, that could help. It is possible that she could be eating something in the yard – if you suspect this is the issue, try not letting her outdoors unsupervised for a few days and see if things clear up. Ultimately, you need to follow your gut and do what you feel is in the best interest of your dog. There’s no reason to feel guilty or like you’re not doing the best you can for her by not feeding raw. If I recall correctly you were feeding Fresh Pet and a 5 star kibble prior to trying raw, while this may not be a raw diet be comforted in knowing this is better than what about 95% of dogs are eating. There are also several non-raw options that, with the addition of digestive enzymes, could be nearly as good as a raw diet. You could try a homemade cooked diet with enzymes and see if she tolerates this better, Fresh Pet + enzymes, a dehydrated food + enzymes (The Honest Kitchen, Grandma Lucy’s, etc.) or a high quality canned food + enzymes. If any of these combinations worked out you could attempt to incorporate a RMB 2 – 3 times a week just as a treat and not at the main component of the diet so that she would get the dental benefits a raw diet has to offer.

[lassiebaby]

lassiebaby
Member
can you please help ? how to post a new message and add profile picture. Thank you.

[Hound Dog Mom]

lassiebaby –

Go to the general forum area and click on the forum you want to post under – at the bottom of the screen there will be a box where you can enter a title and post. To get a picture go to gravatar.com.

[Cyndi]

lassiebaby, go here /forums/topic/how-to-create-your-own-custom-avatar/
to find out about adding a picture. And to post a new topic, go to the forum subject you want, and go to the bottom of the page to start a new topic.

[Hound Dog Mom]

Cyndi –

Another thought – you could try an herbal supplement for loose stools. I’ve never had to use one, but I have heard of individuals having success with them. Many contain ingredients such as slippery elm, marshmallow root, papaya leaf and licorice root. These herbs help to heal the gut and firm stools. Some to look into would be: Perfect Form made by The Honest Kitchen, Gastriplex made by Thorne Research, Phytomucil by Animals’ Apawthecary, GastriX by Hilton Herbs and Enhance by Aunt Jeni’s.

[Cyndi]

HDM, thank you so very much for your opinions and suggestions. I do still have her on the probiotics. Or, I should say I put her back on them when the loose stools started again, along with pumpkin. I’m wondering, instead of the freshpet tomorrow morning, like I have been giving along with a couple other things, maybe I should give her a rmb for breakfast? She hasn’t pooped since this morning so I am going to be on pins and needles till she does go tomorrow. I will keep an eye on her in the yard and not leave her out for a few days, as hard as that will be. And you are correct (good memory) that she was on Fresh pet, well, Deli Fresh and Nature’s Variety Instinct. I do still have her on the Deli Fresh, which I give her in the mornings along with whatever else I have, like chicken grind, or ground beef, etc.

My gut tells me to ride it out and give it just a few more days. I’ll try to keep her diet as regular as I can and see what happens AND supervise her in the yard. I guess I just needed to hear it from someone else. Thank you HDM, so much. I really, really appreciate it! And if you would, could you please cross your fingers for me, lol! I need all the luck I can get. Thanks again!! Have a good evening!

[Cyndi]

HDM, I actually had that written down to get when I get paid on friday. I was actually going to get Dr. Harvey’s Multi Vitamin Mineral & Herbal Dog Supplement, but I will look into the one’s you suggested instead…..or both. Thanks again!!

[lassiebaby]

Thank you very much

[Hound Dog Mom]

The Dr. Harvey’s herbal supplements are like whole food multi-vitamin/minerals – I don’t believe they’re for loose stools so you could give it in combination with one of the herbal stool supplements I suggested. Good luck!

[pugmomsandy]

Cyndi,

Was there a time when she had normal stools? What was she eating then? Can you go back and start over? Give her a longer time to acclimate? Or just give her old food for one meal and raw for the other?

[InkedMarie]

Cyndi: Can you do a combination of many foods: raw, dehydrated, canned, kibble if you want to feed it? I wonder if that might clear up the loose stools and give her a variety.
You may have read I have a few stool issues with one dog and I think I am going to end up doing Darwins & boneless ground for her raw, plus The Honest Kitchen and am going to buy canned as well. She has no teeth so I would prefer no kibble plus I don’t see the need for her to have it

[Cyndi]

Oh, ok. Thanks HDM! I’ll just get one of the herbal stool supplements you suggested, for now. But, let’s hope she does NOT still have loose stools come Friday!

Hi Sandy, Yes, there was a time when she had normal stools. This week starts her 4th full week on raw. She had a problem with runny stools and threw up once right at the beginning, but that only lasted for like a day and a half, 2 days at most. Then she went 11 days with perfect hard, small poops. The only thing that was different in her diet this time she got diarrehea (sorry, I just can not spell that word) was I added a small piece of chicken gizzard to her food. I can see her possibly getting runny stools from that, but not for 4 days, right? I am going to, more or less, start over. I’ll stop introducing new foods and just keep her on chicken thighs and leg quarters and the chicken grind for a bit longer.

So, I gave her breakfast about 45 minutes ago and nothing yet. She didn’t poop first thing this morning, of course, because I fasted her last night, so we’ll see. I’ll keep you guys posted….

Thanks you guys! Happy Memorial Day!!

[Cyndi]

Marie, she’s never had canned or dehydrated, since I’ve had her anyways. So, I’d be really afraid to try something different again, at this point. I’m gonna try to give it a few more days and see what happens, then if sticking with the raw doesn’t work, your idea and what HDM suggested, sound like the option I’ll go with. I really don’t want to go back to just kibble, even though she was getting Nature’s Variety Instict and Deli Fresh, so that wasn’t all THAT bad.

I have read about the problems you are going thru and I hope it’s gotten better for you. This is so frustrating. I know you know that. But, with any luck, maybe just balancing out Bailey’s meals and feeding her what I know she’s been ok with will do the trick.

[InkedMarie]

Cyndi, regarding my dog, it’s hard for me to be okay with pooping every other day but Ive resigned myself to the fact that may be how she is.
Hope you get Bailey’s problems ironed out. You’re right, frustrating it is! What we do for our dogs, eh?

[Cyndi]

I know, right? But I think I’d rather have Bailey poop every other day, lol! I have been going crazy trying to figure out what the heck is going on, but with any luck, I’ll get it all figured out. Thanks Marie! 🙂

[pugmomsandy]

Maybe she’s getting intolerant of chicken. Are you feeding with fat on or off? Have you adjusted her portions up or down? Could she be overeating?

[Cyndi]

I have been feeding her chicken with just about all the skin off. & she’s not overeating, because I weigh everything. If anything, I might not be giving her enough, because I never really adjusted how much I’ve been feeding her since I fast her once a week.

We just got back from her walk and she pooped! A Hard One!!! Yay!!! Lol! It had a bit of moistness with it, in a way, but when I picked it up, the poop was really hard. So, that’s a plus. I was very excited! I guess I shouldn’t be, but it’s better than what she was doing. She’s having a turkey neck for dinner, with no skin, so that shouldn’t be a problem either, so we’ll see how she does…

[Cyndi]

Ok, need someone’s help, please. Math was always my very worst subject. I’m trying to figure out how much I should be feeding Bailey at every meal. She did weigh 53lbs. when I started her on raw and I’d like to keep her there. No clue what she weighs now, because I had my boss weigh her on his scale and it broke, because he got on it holding her to figure out her weight and he’s a BIG guy anyways. I know she hasn’t gained or lost a whole lot. Anyways, I feed her twice a day and I fast her on Sunday evenings for just the one meal. I don’t think I’ve been feeding too much, and like I said to Sandy, I may be feeding too little.

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

[Hound Dog Mom]

Hi Cyndi –

No one’s ever accused me of being good at math either…well at least not calculus lol. Raw food calculations are one of the few mathematical calculations I can handle though!

In general, dogs should eat (as a percentage of their weight):
-1.5% for weightloss
-2.0% for inactive dogs
-2.5% for adult dogs of average activity level
-3.0% for active dogs or dogs of average/low activity needing to gain weight
-3.5% for very active dogs or active dogs needing to gain weight
-4.0% for working adult dogs and puppies (8 weeks – 1 year)
-4.5% – 8.0% for heavy-duty working dogs, puppies under 8 weeks and pregnant/lactating females

Based on these guidelines, assuming Baily is of average activity level Bailey should be eating:

53 lbs. X 0.025 = 1.325 lbs. or 21.2 oz. per day

To factor in her 24 hour fast:

[(21.2 oz./day)(7 days/week)]/13 meals per week = 11.42 oz. per meal

Keep in mind – these are just guidelines, you’ll need to assess her body condition frequently and adjust her portions accordingly. Gus eats about 2.5% of his body weight, Mabel eats about 3.5% of her body weight and Gertie eats about 4.0% of her body weight (with their weekly fast factored in). Also – these calculations are for the meat portion (muscle meat, organ meat, bone) only. Don’t count veggies toward the calculation.

• This reply was modified 11 years, 5 months ago by Hound Dog Mom.

[Cyndi]

Thanks so much HDM! I tried so hard to figure that out and my brain just goes elsewhere after a few tries, lol! That’s actually about what I’ve been feeding her, maybe a bit less. I don’t exactly know what an “average” activity level is, but that’s what I always assumed. I would imagine it’s ok to feed less at one meal and then more at her 2nd meal of the day, but making sure she’s getting very close to what she should be eating for the day. Sometimes, like when I give her a turkey neck, I adjust her other meal for the day accordingly.

Not sure if you saw what I wrote earlier, but she pooped this morning on our walk and it was HARD!!! 🙂 Made my day! Thanks for ALL your help!

[Hound Dog Mom]

Hard poop – yay! 🙂

And yes – it’s perfectly fine to feed more at one meal and less at the other.

[pugmomsandy]

Do you think she’s getting too much bone? Chicken legs and thighs and turkey necks have more bone than say – a whole prey that is about 10% bone.

[Cyndi]

I don’t think so Sandy. If she was getting too much, wouldn’t that have the opposite effect of runny poop? I thought her poop would be too hard if she was getting too much bone. I really haven’t been giving her that many chicken legs. & she’s only had a turkey neck twice, tonight being the second time. Thanks for your input though. I really appreciate any feedback, just in case there IS something I’m missing.

[Cyndi]

2nd poop today, HARD!! 🙂 🙂 🙂 Finally, a whole day without diarreha! (sp?)

[theBCnut]

Diarrhea is the pits, both dealing with it and spelling it!!!

[Cyndi]

Ha ha!!! Ain’t that the truth! I can’t for the life of me, ever remember how to spell that damn word anymore! I’ve just given up. I spell it different every time I write, but I figure you guys know what I mean, lol!

[theBCnut]

You had all the right letters. That’s better than I do. I’m spelling challenge, I actually have a learning disability that makes spelling a huge challenge. I keep a dictionary app by my side at all times and a know it all 17 year old child and I still find myself misspelling word after word. Sometimes I’ll see something I wrote three days before and all of a sudden I can spell, at least I can see what I misspelled three days ago.

Anyway, take your victories where you find them. WooHoo, no diarrhea today!!

[Cyndi]

I usually use dictionary.com, especially for work. But, I just don’t care most of the time, & I figure if most of the letters are there, & somewhere close to where they should be, people should know what I mean, and I’m lazy, lol! It doesn’t help that my computer mocks me by underlining the word, telling me its spelled wrong, but won’t tell me the right way to spell it!

& Yes!! Woo Hoo, no runny poop!!

[theBCnut]

Then there’s autocorrect on my iPod, even when I spell it right it still tries to switch out the word on me. Whenever I type my own name it tries to make it party. It is supposed to learn the words I commonly use, I’m not a party animal.

[Cyndi]

Lol! Party animal! Lol! Cmon, Patty, admit. Now we’re all gonna find out about the real you! Lol!

[Anonymous]

I’ll leave the advice on raw to the experts, I just want to add that you’d probably save money in vet bills feeding your girl a raw diet.

[Bongo Buddy]

Cyndi,
I read thru this whole post, so I’m dying to know if the diarrhea problem is gone? I’m new here & want to try raw too.

[pugmomsandy]

Bongo Buddy,

It did clear up. She posted about it in the “all natural dog shampoo” thread.

[Cyndi]

Thanks Sandy, & yes Bongo Buddy it did clear up. Here is a link to the thread that pugmomsandy was talking about. The last 2 comments of mine address that issue.

/forums/topic/all-natural-dog-shampoo/

My suggestion to you Bongo Buddy, read, read, read, take notes, ask questions, etc. I researched for about 2 and a half months before I finally bit the bullet and started my dog on raw. I am SO glad I did!

Good luck to you! There is A LOT of information in the forums and you can always ask questions. The people here helped me more than I could have imagined and if it wasn’t for them, I don’t think I’d have stuck with it! It’s the best thing you can do for your dog!

[Cyndi]

Just wanted to share some more good news with all of you! Bailey’s poop is still normal (small, solid) (knock on wood, lol!) AND I gave her chicken liver with her dinner, for the first time yesterday, and she loved it AND it didn’t give her runny poop! I did only give her a little bit, but I was all prepared for it not to agree with her, but she’s been fine. Yay! 🙂

[Hound Dog Mom]

Glad to hear it, I bet you’re happy you stuck with it! 🙂

[Author]

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