[nathaniel reid]

It’s wonderful to hear that your Havapoo is starting to thrive after such a tough start. Given her medical history and sensitive stomach, it’s important to be cautious when introducing new treats. Jiminy’s treats are a good option since they use sustainable ingredients like crickets, which are high in protein and easy on the digestive system. The Pumpkin & Carrot flavor she already enjoys is a great choice because pumpkin is known for its digestive benefits, while carrots are a low-calorie, healthy treat.

Regarding the PB & Cranberry flavor, it’s also a good option. Peanut butter (PB) is a common dog treat ingredient, but ensure it’s free from xylitol, an artificial sweetener toxic to dogs. Cranberries are a good source of vitamins and antioxidants, and they may support urinary health, which is crucial given her history of struvite stones.

However, because of her sensitive stomach, you might want to introduce any new flavor gradually and monitor her reaction. If she enjoys the Pumpkin & Carrot flavor and it agrees with her system, sticking with it might be the safest choice.

[RosiePops Mom]

I adopted a 4.5 year old Havapoo in mid-Feb of this year. Within three weeks, I had spent about $3k in medical bills and surgery for struvite stones. She has extreme anxiety and the vet says she has PTSD from living in a bad situation previously, and from the severe pain the untreated, very large stones that were lodged in the walls of her bladder caused. She has been on RC Urinary SO + Hydrolyzed Protein Formula because she has a very sensitive tummy since surgery. Now that she’s feeling better she has started Prozac and the occasional xanax for her anxiety/fear. She is really coming out of her shell. She’s funny, smart and learning how to play. She loves games and learning tricks. I am looking for a reward/training treat I can give her. The vet suggested using pieces of her normal food but she’s not an enthusiastic eater so that won’t work. While visiting my son recently, she tried these natural treats made by Jiminy’s (made with crickets), and was crazy for them. I’ve tried researching the ingredients butt there is so much conflicting information that I’m not sure what to trust. Could I get some opinions, please?

The flavor she tried and loved was Pumpkin & Carrot, but I’m wondering if the PB & Cranberry might be healthier?

Dog Treats: Dog Biscuits, Training treats & Snacks

[Eric S]

Hi, so we’re in the same boat with Struvite crystals. Looking at the ingredients of Royal Canin Veterinary Diet Adult Urinary SO, I see the first 6 include: Brewers Rice, Corn, Chicken Fat, Corn Gluten Meal, Chicken By-Product Meal, Brewers Rice Flour… This seems like crappy food for our dogs. So, is this the best bet for dogs with crystals? Please advise on what you’re using. We have a two year old Golden Doodle

[Yvonne K]

Thank you Marcia H for the information you provided specifically for communicating several recalls on blue Buffalo and how the diamond brand is terrible. I have been looking for an alternative dog food for my three year old golden doodle that has struvite crystals and constant ear infections. She is currently on royal Canin urinary SO and it helps with the struvite crystals but certainly doesn’t keep her ears from getting infected and I clean them daily. The Cytopoint injections help but the cost is prohibitive. My vet hasn’t been too helpful in narrowing down the best choice for my dog, so thank you very much for your input. It is very much appreciated.

[Deborah H]

My dog had surgery to remove struvite stones. Five months later she had second surgery to remove the same. Urine culture revealed staph infection and she is now on longterm antibiotics. We have tried the prescription diets but she hates them. Can anyone share a homemade recipe for dogs with history of struvite stones?

[Susan C]

What food were you feeding when your dog developed the struvite crystals please ? I hope you can find answers and solutions. ❤️

[aimee]

Hi Claire,

My understanding is that struvite crystals are quite common and a normal finding in dogs which do not require any specific treatment. They are a concern there is a history of sterile struvite stone formation. which is very rare. Most struvite stones form secondary to infection and my understanding is diet will not prevent urinary infection or stone formation secondary to infection.

“Struvite crystalluria occurs in greater than 50% of healthy dogs, including animals without urinary tract infections”https://www.dvm360.com/view/stones-vs-crystals-management-and-prevention-proceedings

Since leaking urine at night is a new sign consider checking for infection or presence of other contributing factors or causes.

I would consider SO to be a high quality nutritious food

[Claire S]

Ooops they are Struvite Crystals btw!

[Patricia A]

Maybe a starting point would be to find a food low in fat but has a good protein level. I feed freeze dried raw. This way with the hydration they are getting plenty of water. I also stick to only the LOW IN FAT proteins because my one would get diarrhea with the high fat. So maybe the best you can do with diet is the hard task of helping with the pancreatitis as well as the bladder stones is the high protein/low fat diet.
I read this in Whole Dog Journal
Low-protein diets have also been shown to predispose dogs to pancreatitis, especially when combined with high fat intake. Some prescription diets may be a concern, such as those prescribed to dissolve struvite bladder stones; to prevent calcium oxalate, urate, or cystine stones; and to treat kidney disease; especially for breeds prone to pancreatitis.

• This reply was modified 4 years, 8 months ago by Patricia A.

[Frenky C]

Hi Marion, actually the symptom of your pup may very well be secondary to a urinary tract infection. It can cause urinary retention due to dysuria (pain upon urination). That may have caused your pup to be uncomfortable. It is common for urine tests to show some crystals but that doesn’t necessarily mean that your pup has struvite stones in the bladder or any other stone. Antibiotics will solve dysuria. However I suggest you take an xray rather than urine testing strips to confirm presence of bladder stones outright.

[Marion W]

Thank you for replying Cherie. We’ve only had a urine
Test in which they showed me the crystals. May be because of the fact the owner has little money they didn’t suggest any X ray but there was no blood in the urine just difficulty passing it. Eventually taking Oliver off the prescription food is a huge decision. I was reading struvite is only a problem if there is an infection too. I was thinking of looking to see if I can buy the urine testing strips. It’s a dilemma as no one wants to compromise a dog’s health. Thanks again.

[Cherie G]

I sent a note here in 2017. My Bischon was a rescue and only adopted her at @ 3 yrs of age, so I didn’t know what she ate or drank prior to. The evening I started to foster her (before adopting) she was urinating blood and very often. I called the rescue and she had surgery the following day. Her struvite was as large as a small egg! She had surgery to remove it and I was very careful with the recommended food and a lot of water. I put water in her food 2x day and also would add a little chicken broth or beef broth occasionally to get her to drink more water. The food suggested is the same as your vet advised and I kept her on that for at least a year and then started to stray away because of the cost. After 2 years I had an xray taken and she had no stones. I am going to go back on the recommended foods just to be sure. I believe the water is very important/ Cherie

[Marion W]

Hi, I walk my disabled neighbour’s young male cockapoo and noticed he had a problem trying to urinate and by the end of the walk he appeared to be very uncomfortable. Short of it is the vet diagnosed struvite crystals by testing his urine. He did pass a catheter in but believe that was to ensure there was no blockage there. Gave him a week’s course of antibiotics and metacam and the dog has to go back in 9 days to see if they have dissolved. The owner has been told she he can have no other food other than prescription for life at the moment he is on Hill’s S/d which is very expensive. When he eventually goes onto Hill’s C/d if they have dissolved it will cost her £1300.00 pa without the boosters, grooming, de worming and flea care. She just hasn’t got this money and we are helping where we can but we are unable to keep paying.

I have read all the comments on the forum as regards the special dietary food and it will be a huge decision to eventually take him off it. The vet says these crystals can be life threatening in he gets a blockage.

My question is did you find out yours had struvite crystals in the same way I did, by the dog having difficulty passing urine?

We are very confused as to know what to do once we have confirmation of that the crystals have dissolved.

Many thanks

[m3ntat]

Prescription Royal Canin SO diet can help dissolve struvite uroliths specifically, and prevent formation of struvite and oxolate uroliths. RC also makes multiple diets with the SO index, including a behavior modifying diet, Calm. Stress is primary contributor to urinary disease, including bacterial infections, sterile inflammation, uroliths in the bladder (cystolith) or kidneys (nephrolith), as unsure which your vet has diagnosed. Moderating stress with diet, supplements, environment, and exercise, can help reduce stress induced disease and inflammation. Feliway (cat) and Dog Appeasing pheremone products are very helpful. Over the counter products by veterinary companies, such as Composure (Vetriscience), Zylkene (Vetoquinol), and Calming Care (Purina) are the most utilized amongst vet professionals. Long-term use of the rx urinary diet is recommended in repeat urethral obstruction or urolith affected pets. Obstruction by crystals blood/bladder cells, and stones is emergent, as blood cannot flow through the kidneys to filter toxins into urine, and toxins accumulate in the blood, leading to electrolyte imbalance, azotemia, dehydration, hypotension, and shock left untreated. Since he is older onset, ensuring water intake and more elimination opportunities on walks/yard visits will help decrease risk for concentrated urine accumulating crystals, which can form uroliths that gain size the longer crystals are present. Dilution decreases urine crystal formation. Inquire as to the serum kidney values, to ensure underlying kidney changes are not the contributors to the bacteria and crystals sited in his urine. Ultrasound is the best way to diagnose urinary tract changes, inflammation, and foreign material; limited abdominal U/S can find early kidney changes, prior to any abnormality in serum/blood work. Hope your boy continues to improve, as he already sounds 100% turnaround. Link to SO index Calm diet https://www.royalcanin.com/us/dogs/products/vet-products/canine-calm-dry-dog-food

[anonymous]

I would feed the food that your vet recommends. Was an ultrasound done to rule out bladder stones? Ask your vet…because often dogs can have more than one type of stones along with crystals.
Food does not dissolve all types of stones, sometimes surgery is needed.

had a dog with calcium oxalate bladder stones, struvite crystals and urinary tract infections. It was serious, emergency surgery and all.
From what I could tell, the main culprits were genetic predisposition and inadequate water intake, not the food.
A lot of pet owners serve kibble dry. Put down a bowl of water and assume their dogs are drinking enough….this is often not the case.
Also, expecting these dogs to hold their urine for 10 hours a day is conducive to stagnant conditions in the bladder, perfect environment for crystals and bladder stones to form.
Keep the bladder flushed, offer bathroom breaks at the minimum, every 4 hours (every 2 hours is ideal). Exercise, long walks, keep the weight down. Feed twice a day, measured amounts.

[Laura H]

The Hills S/O and S/D do work. My pug was completely full of struvite crystals. After one $4,000 surgery they returned 6 months later. Instead of surgery, they put her on the s/o for 6 months and they were all dissolved. It was a much better option then surgery again. However, she had an infection both times that needed to be treated as well. Struvite stones only form in the presence of infection. Now I make sure she drinks a lot of water and i water down her food. Any sign of problems or infections then I will be back to the vet.

[Laura H]

Struvite stones are caused by infection and changing diets won’t eliminate infection. My vet claimed my dog needed to be on a special food for life as well. She was always starving and lost weight. I have done a lot of research since and experts say if your vet claims your dog needs a special food for struvite crystals, you need a new vet! This is from vet nutritionists. Your dog needs PLENTY of Water……water down the food heavily and make sure he/she drinks a lot. Beware of infections! That’s the real culprit.

• This reply was modified 5 years, 5 months ago by Laura H. Reason: needed to clarify

[David H]

My Parsons Russell Terrier was suffering from tiny bladder stones about 10 years ago, had bladder stone surgery multiple times and hydropullions to remove the stones from his urethra. He was part of a study at UC Davis and after testing his stones and bloodwork they determined he was had a combination urate/struvite Crystal’s, with this information I decided to put him on Prescription diet W/D which is low protein, low fat, high fiber, I add a cup of water to it to keep things flowing. Has been 10 years and not one issue. I’ve told several people people whose dogs were having the same issue, no more issues to speak of. Hope this help anyone who chooses to use. May save them $. Take care

[K K]

Hi. Sorry this is a later post. But my sheltie had surgery last Thanksgiving for bladder stones – biopsy showed struvite – they said her bladder felt like a bean bag. But, no infection! They wanted me to switch her to one of Hill’s prescription diets but I don’t think much of the quality of their foods and they’ve had several recent recalls. The vet also suggested adding “wet food.” Since then, I’ve been soaking her kibble in water before feeding. Her last urinalysis did show crystal formation but again no infection.

My problem now is that the food I’ve been feeding has changed. Ancestry (formerly Sammy Snacks) has been taken over — now “Ancestry Pet Food” and the food has changed. I had been feeding the grain-free Lamb and Sweet Potato which Dog Food Advisory gave 5 stars. I want to switch.

In the past I used Acana when it was still made in Canada, which is no longer the case. I am also wondering if a higher protein diet in grain-free formulas like the Ancestry and in Acana and Orijen may be the cause of the increase in urinary crystals and the formation of struvite stones. Is anyone familiar with this issue.

My pup is only 4 years old, so not a senior dog issue.

Thanks.

K

[crazy4cats]

My cat had a urinary blockage with struvite crystals. He’s been on Royal Canin Rx food ever since. He is doing great!

[crazy4cats]

Hi Hannah O-

I only have experience with struvite crystals. They can be dissolved, the oxalate ones cannot.

I feed my cat that has experienced a blockage an Royal Canin Rx Diet. It has an S/O index, which is supposed to help prevent both types of crystal/stones. I would imagine they would have a similar formula for dogs. Does your dog have a urinary tract infection? Often with dogs, they coincide with crystals.

Below is a link that may be helpful. I’m sure it is stressful. What is your vet recommending?

https://www.vetmed.umn.edu/centers-programs/minnesota-urolith-center/urolith-analysis/treatment-recommendations

[anonymous]

/forums/search/struvite+oxalate/

I hope some of my posts help.

Ask questions after you review and I will do my best to answer.

[Hannah O]

Hello all! My 7 year old red cocker spaniel developed struvite issues 3 years ago. He had them flushed twice and was placed into Hills CD diet which I was told was a life long preventative measure. He has since developed oxalate issues due to the long term acidic nature of his urine. He has also developed a bit of a leak (no infection present) which makes it hard to flush him with high volumes of water, though we go our best. Has anyone had a dog with both struvite and oxalate issues? I’m struggling to find info as treatment for one can exacerbate the other and finding balance is proving very challenging so far. Thank you, all constructive ideas gratefully received.

[Debora C]

Hey all. I”m looking for a good quality, Hi animal protein, low carb dog food. My female continues to get UTI, or struvite crystals. I’d like to try lessening the carbs she eats and upping the protein. PResently she is eating Nutrisource adult chicken and rice. She is a year and a half and is an active dog. She weighs about 50 pounds. I just read that Nutrisource has a super Performance dog food, but would love to know what else is available that actually contains real meat / meal. I do not want a grain free dog food.
thanks bunches and have a super night.
~debbie

[Melanie O]

Hello,

I also have a dog that was just diagnosed with struvite crystals and the vet told me I had to put her on Royal Canin SO food indefinitely to dissolve the crystals and lower the PH of her urine.
I cannot afford this. I buy her the best dog food I can, I read the ingredients of each bag to make sure I am getting a food that doesn’t have a lot of garbage in it – ultimately ending up in my spending about 36.00 a bag. This is at the high end of my budget and the royal canin, for a smaller bag is going to cost me double that.

I am looking for alternatives to reducing the ph in her urine as well as dissolving the crystals. Nothing in her bladder, there was a tiny bit of bacteria but no blood. I was thinking of getting cranberry relief chews for her to help with infection but how do i dissolve the crystals in her urine and/or reduce the ph? I was going through a lot of the posts but there are so many I thought I would just go about it this way. You all are such a wealth of information I can’t wait to hear from you!

[anonymous]

Also, diet is just part of the treatment.

https://bichonhealth.org/kidneysbladder/management-of-bichons-with-urinary-stones/

excerpts below, click on link for full article

It has long been recognized that some Bichons Frises have a predisposition to formation of urinary stones (uroliths). This condition is known as urolithiasis. There are several types of stones that can form in the bladder, with struvite (also called magnesium triple phosphate or “infection” stones) and calcium oxalate being the most common in Bichons. The most important preventative for stone formation is free access to fresh water. For a dog predisposed to stone formation, there are other considerations as well. This article is intended to provide the pet owner with a better understanding of the prevention and treatment of urinary stones. Good veterinary treatment is the most reliable resource for the ongoing care of your dog. You may wish to copy this article for your veterinarian.

[anonymous]

No.
Have you checked the internet for prices? As long as your vet okays it you don’t have to buy it from him.

More Nonsense from Holistic Vets about Commercial Therapeutic Diets

Copied from a previous post:
Also, if the dog is overweight, get the extra weight off, increase walks/exercise/activity.
Work closely with your vet, when the dog has been stable 6 months to 1 year then you can talk about diet changes.
“Dogs that get urinary tract infections and bladder stones tend to have a genetic predisposition, combine that with not enough water intake, not enough opportunities to urinate and you have a problem”.
“Whatever you decide to feed, add water to the kibble or canned food, even presoak and add water. Take out to urinate at least every 4 hours (every 2 hours is ideal) stagnant conditions in the bladder are conducive to bladder stone formation”.
“Always have fresh water available for the dog 24/7”.
“Supplements are crap, don’t waste your money unless your vet recommends something specific for your dog”.
Ps: You think the prescription food is expensive. Try emergency surgery for a blocked urethra.
Been there, done that.
Regarding cranberry: http://skeptvet.com/Blog/?s=cranberry
Also there are prescription meds for stubborn cases, talk to your vet.
Was an ultrasound done? Dogs can have more than one type of stone, such as calcium oxalate and struvite…that was the case with my dog that had reoccurring UTIs.
This is not veterinary advice; consult your veterinarian.
PS: Note recent question on struvite in comments: http://skeptvet.com/Blog/2016/09/science-based-veterinary-nutrition-success-stories/comment-page-1/#comment-121266
Good luck

[anonymous]

https://bichonhealth.org/kidneysbladder/management-of-bichons-with-urinary-stones/

More Nonsense from Holistic Vets about Commercial Therapeutic Diets

Copied from a previous post:
Also, if the dog is overweight, get the extra weight off, increase walks/exercise/activity.
Work closely with your vet, when the dog has been stable 6 months to 1 year then you can talk about diet changes.
“Dogs that get urinary tract infections and bladder stones tend to have a genetic predisposition, combine that with not enough water intake, not enough opportunities to urinate and you have a problem”.
“Whatever you decide to feed, add water to the kibble or canned food, even presoak and add water. Take out to urinate at least every 4 hours (every 2 hours is ideal) stagnant conditions in the bladder are conducive to bladder stone formation”.
“Always have fresh water available for the dog 24/7”.
“Supplements are crap, don’t waste your money unless your vet recommends something specific for your dog”.
Ps: You think the prescription food is expensive. Try emergency surgery for a blocked urethra.
Been there, done that.
Regarding cranberry: http://skeptvet.com/Blog/?s=cranberry
Also there are prescription meds for stubborn cases, talk to your vet.
Was an ultrasound done? Dogs can have more than one type of stone, such as calcium oxalate and struvite…that was the case with my dog that had reoccurring UTIs.
This is not veterinary advice; consult your veterinarian.
PS: Note recent question on struvite in comments: http://skeptvet.com/Blog/2016/09/science-based-veterinary-nutrition-success-stories/comment-page-1/#comment-121266
Good luck

[Susan]

Hi Sara,

Change your vet look for a female Holistic Vet or a female vet who isnt chained to these vet diets, I don’t dislike vet diets, yes they are good to use “temporary” until owner works out what to feed once your dog is stable, did you know back in 2013 I remember reading the side of one of the vet diets Patch was on for his IBD, it said, this formua is not to be feed long term…Vet diets weren’t meant to be feed long term, the dog was suppose to get stable then another diet was feed…
Now the vets Diets have been reformulated, can be feed long term now since 2015…
In Australia we can buy a vet diet straight from a vet practice or order online & do not need no presciption or vet, this just proves vet diet are nothing real special & there’s better alternative out there that are healthier & probably cheaper..

I dont understand why is your vet isnt looking into WHY your girl is having this problems in the first place, she is only 1 yr old. Did vet say why this was happening to a 1 yr old dog?
Your vet sound like Patches 2nd vet we got after I rescue him, I was scared to ask him for anything, I remember telling him my boy IBD has gotten worse on this vet diet, he said he needs to be on it longer, after being on the vet diet 1 month I bought the big bag back & told the a vet nurse its not working I want my money back & I told her that my vet John wasnt listening & Patch is pooing water now, his front paws are red & he’s crying 11pm every night & swollowing acid, she went in & asked another vet can I try the Royal Canine Sensitivitiy Control & this is how Patch gets his GOOD female vet who is his still his vet now….

Dogs and cats are designed to eat meat & when they’re are fed a grain-based diet or a starch-rich diet, the starch alkalizes urine pH, which can lead to the development of struvite crystals and stones.
Also is she she having wee breaks every 3 hours?
I would be looking at feeding your girl a raw balanced diet, there’s a few good Pre-made raw diets around, like “Answers Fermented ” Answers raw is suppost to be very good, it’s a bit expensive but its probably around the same price of a vet diet?? ..

I’ve read alot of people’s post who have female dogs (older then your girl) who have urinary problems swear by using “D-Mannose” Pure Powder Healthy Urinary Tract..

Start strengthening her Immune System, get some goats milk add to her diet for breakfast make sure she is having regular wee breaks every 3 hours…
also look into Vitamin C High Potency Powder or I think the D-Mannose has Vitamin C??

For now give the Hills wet & dry vet diet, look for an Holistic Vet or a vet who has been educated in dog Nutrition alot vets just know Hills, Royal Canin & Purina. Ask the vet why he didnt he prescribe Hills Urinary Care, Multicare C/d wet & dry formula’s instead? Ingredients are better in wet & dry formula’s, thats if you do stay feeding the Hills vet diet. Ypu could feed the Hill C/D Wet can food, for 1 of her meals.

My boy was put on the Royal Canine S/O Urinary wet & dry for 6 weeks, he had another Ultra Scan & his crystal had dissolved, all clear, I rescued him & he was weeing blood then the rescue vet said put him back on what he was eating before…
His crystals were from being used as a breeding dog the rescue vet said, he was 4yrs old.

Here’s Hills C/d wet can food
https://www.hillspet.com/dog-food/pd-cd-multicare-canine-chicken-and-vegetable-canned#accordion-content-054167331-2
Feed till you work out what you’re doing..

Start joining few Face Book Holistic Health Dog groups & you’ll find your way..

*”K-9 Kitchen” run by Monica Segal

* “K-9 Nutrition” run by Lew Olson

Dr Judy Morgan DVM
https://www.facebook.com/pg/JudyMorganDVM/videos/?ref=page_internal

* Holistic Dog Care
https://www.facebook.com/groups/Holisticdogcare/?ref=group_header

[Sara B]

Hello-

I have done some searching around on the forum for various discussions related to this topic. It is a bit tricky to sort through all of them so I thought I would just put this out there to see what folks have to say or what experiences they have had. I have a 1 year old lab mix who has been diagnosed with struvite crystals. She has had a UTI. I also just had a sample of her urine sent off to a lab for a culture to get more information. She may be going on an antibiotic.
Obviously my concern is that those will turn into stones which would not be good. My other concern though is that vet has prescribed Hills U/D. I asked him if he had any other options for my dog and he said no she would need to be on this for the rest of her life. I went home and looked at the ingredient list and cannot for the life of me understand how this is better than the food I am currently feeding her. I am also concerned about the side affects (weight gain, allergies etc). I have her on Honest Kitchen food right now to help with the increased water intake and have ordered Super Snouts Urniary Berry to help with the PH and hopefully preventing UTIs. Wondering if I should put her on the Hills Science for a time and then once the crystals dissolve go back to her food? Or If I should do a combo of the two? I dont really feel that I can ask my vet for suggestions because he seems unwilling to help in that regard.

[crazy4cats]

Hi Cathy-
I do not have dogs with this issue, but I did have a cat that had a urinary blockage a few years back. They were Struvite crystals though. They are much more common than silica. Scary stuff. You definitely want to stop them from forming. As far as ratings go on this site, I wouldn’t worry about them. It’s tough to rate food by the ingredient label, especially for a dog with a medical condition.
Listen to your vet! ProPlan is a great food. Purina is a large company that has been around for a long time. They do a lot of ongoing research, they employ full time board certified veterinary nutritionists, and they own their own manufacturing plant.

I have been following the “DCM thing”. So far, there have been no dogs diagnosed with it that have been fed Purina PP. Their food contains all the amino acids that enable dogs to synthesize their own taurine in addition to the taurine that is in the food. There are also no known ingredients that will block it from being absorbed. I recently switched back to Purina and my dogs are doing great. We all need to listen to our vets more. They know more about nutrition than we give them credit for. Good luck to you.

[Tanya K]

Anon101,

No, I understand what you’re saying. The homeopathic way can get a little intense — it may be too complex for me, too. lol My other dog is also on the food and she’s vomiting a lot as well. So, I’m pretty convinced it’s the food. I’m more than likely going to have a very long appointment talking about different options. I mean for the struvite stones, they are usually no problem but the oxalate stones are an entire other issue so the vet is like, “too low, you may increase the odds of this one” too high “and you may increase the odds of the other.” So my whole issue is if he can’t balance it what do I do? And how does this food not affect my other dog? That’s weird, too.

Tanya

[anonymous]

@ Tanya K
Please listen to your vet instead of the internet and dog food marketing strategies.
Dogs that get bladder stones often have a genetic predisposition (struvite and calcium oxalate are the most common), not enough water is another contributing factor.

Please see my posts, example:
/forums/topic/bladder-stones-in-6-year-old-female-pug/#post-113166

/forums/topic/dogs-with-struvite-bladder-stones/#post-104899

[Tanya K]

Hello. I’m new to this forum but I have a question right off the bat. I have a 10 year old Shih Tzu/Poodle Mix. She had emergency surgery earlier this year to remove a calcium oxalate stone that was stuck in her urinary tract. She also had struvite stones. My vet put her on one food (then urinalysis) but her ph was too low. So, he prescribed her another supplement to raise the PH. Her PH is still too low. He had to discuss with another vet and both are seemingly mystified as to why they can’t get her PH higher. Basically, they are at a loss with what to do. So now she is on a new prescription food (and more urinalysis — omg, so many urinalysis tests!) So, his advice is to stay on the prescription food and do x-rays every so often to make sure she’s not getting stones again.

I hate the thought of her being on this food forever. For one thing, I pride myself on having dogs who throw up next to never. She was previously on Earthborn Holistic but now she’s on one of the prescription diets and she’s constantly throwing up as is my other pooch (who the vet said was okay to eat that food as well.)

Basically, I feel like if I have to get her x-rays every once in a while then why not feed her what she was already on? She’s eaten Earthborn for nearly her entire life. The only difference in diet before she got the stones were some Etta Says chews — those were the only things that were given that were different to what she normally had within the time frame it takes to develop stones.

I am wondering if anyone else has done this … going against the vet’s counsel? I trust him as a vet, but I just figure wtf — this food is making her ill. It’s making my other dog ill. If they can’t get her PH to a happy medium then why not give her what she was eating before? Thoughts? Any advice would be greatly appreciated.

Tanya

[Linda H]

My two girls 13 years 8 months have just been diagnosed with silica stones.One has had two surgeries in the past. One for Oxalate and one for struvite. She has had the hydropulsion to wash out eight silica stones. The other has one small silica stone.These stones were seen on ultrasound. I have been aware all these years of how to try to keep the stones out. Giving lots of distilled water, canned food and watching the diet with very good quality food. Vets go back and forth in changing foods and I do not think Vets know anything about food. Again the stone problem has come up and this time silica. The Vets again do not know what kind of food to recommend. When having the stones researched to find the kind they are, I received information from Minnesota Lab about the kind of food to avoid. I need to find the kind of food they CAN have. Can anyone send information about a food that has worked for your pets (canine) that is a lasting food for good health?
I am desperate to find a food for my girls for their good health.
Thank you so very much.

[Linda H]

My two girls have silica stones and I cannot find a food for them. I saw someone suggested Nulo Sr Trout but cannot find that, also Nulo Large Dog Chicken or Turkey. what is the brand name? Is it Nulo? does it require a prescription from a vet?

My vet told me to get Hills canine low fat i?D stew # prn. This is Pork and have no way of knowing about this food.He also said he does not know about silica so I am trying to research this food before starting them on it.

Can the person recommending Nulo please let me know about it and has it helped with the silica stones?

Has anyone reported what causes these stones? One of my girls has has Oxolate and Struvite and I can find information about that but not silica.

Please send any information. Thanks.

[Laura R]

I have an 18 month old Australian Shepherd male who is reluctant to pee. Someone is home with him all day, so he goes out often enough. The vet has not prescribed any antibiotics as he sees no evidence of infection. He is convinced it is the food and recommended regular Science Diet or Iams food (not an rx formula). When I asked why he thought it was the food, he just seemed to think it was a function of his metabolism.

The best I can figure out he recommended these foods because they are low in phosphorus. My dog had previously been on Canidae All Life Stage and when that didn’t work I tried Health Extension GF venison, which still didn’t work. Most dog foods do not list their phosphorous content or do so in a vague “min” quantity when
I need a max quantity… I did find one website which listed low phosphorus commercial foods, but it was very out of date and inaccurate.

So after going through chronic kidney failure and a raw/homemade diet with a previous dog, I decided to try a balanced raw diet (see Dr. Karen Becker’s diets on YouTube). But for a 40# dog it is not cheap or easy and I have only been doing it as half his diet along with the Science Diet (because I think this is crappy food). I also added Nutramax Crananidin, additional ascorbic acid, and calcium in order to boost the calcium:phosphorus ratio closer to what other sources recommend to be 2:1. Since this dog does not drink water at all (despite having bought a purifier and all), I also put a cup of water/broth on his food both am and pm.

I just feel like I am at my wits end. In the afternoons/evenings, his urine pH runs around 7.5. This morning, I tested it and it was a lovely 5.5! Additionally, we have taken samples to the vet for analysis and we get different results on different days/times with crystals and no crystals present.

All this leaves me feeling like I don’t understand what is working and why, and a dog that is miserable! We are going to add a little broth to his water today to see if that will get him to drink during the day, but if anyone else has suggestions or insight, I would be greatly appreciative.

[Jen T]

Thanks Sheila for your response and your current routine. Will have to try cottage cheese and see how she does.

Thanks for responding Acroyali. Our vet sent the stones to Minnesota Urolith Center and they came back as Struvite and Osseous material (vet believes it’s from her tumor). The only therapy everyone has suggested (multiple vets as well as Minnesota Urolith Center) is switching her diet to a prescription diet which may not prevent the stones.

[Linda B]

my 4 yeara old chihuahua mix has developed urinary crystals. she has at least three different kids. struvite and oxalate and amorphous phosphate. he started her on purina pro UR which she hates, canned and dry…I rechecked her two weeks later and thats when the other two crystals showed up. He said to keep her on the food. I insisted on another urine and took one in 6 weeks later. i will get the results tomorrow. I need to ind her something to eat that she will actually eat. I was feeding her Merrick back in the day, and she quit eating it and i tried earthborn. she wasn’t real crazy about it either. Then she went on purina pro focus, then they found these crystals. anyone have any idea what kind of food would be good to help with the crystals that is maybe not so disgusting the dog won’t eat it? haha I need help, badly, and any help you give me will be appreciated by me and Baby! Thanks Her ph was 7.0, her specific gravity was elevated at 1.059. Protein was elevated at 1+ she did not have any bacteria in her urine like you see sometimes with struvites. He did not put her on an antibiotic since it showed no UTI

[crazy4cats]

Hi Graciela-
Sorry to hear about your pup! You could try http://www.balanceit.com to formulate a recipe for your dog. However, if your dog has a health condition, they need to work with your vet a bit to ensure it fits your dog’s needs.

I have a cat who produces struvite crystals and ended up with a life threatening blockage about 3 or 4 years ago. Since then, I have been feeding him Royal Canin kibble with an s/o index. They actually have five or six formulas with the s/o index for cats. I feed him the one called “Calm”. I think they have it for dogs too.

He hasn’t had another issue. I also feed him canned and have a water fountain to ensure that he gets plenty of moisture in his diet.

I believe the s/o index helps prevent further stones. I just don’t look at the ingredients. Just the results!!

Good luck!

[Marjorie M]

Noelle M- not sure if you’ll see this, but I hope you do- my dog has a struvite stone and I am looking into more nutritional/natural ways to dissolve it. Can you tell me exactly what you did to get the stone dissolved. My dog is on Hill’s s/d and not only is it crappy food, it’s $$$! I know it should work, but my dog needs to be on it for 6 months. 6 months!!! Is there another effective method? Will the Perfomathrin help dissolve the stone? Thank YOU!!

[Marjorie M]

I’m at my wit’s end! My 11 year old female dog was recently diagnosed with a struvite bladder stone (felt, not X-rayed). The vet told me 6 months on canned Hill’s s/d. Umm, that will cost over $1,000! And I’ve heard the food isn’t very good for dogs. Is there a more natural/holistic diet that I can put her on to dissolve the stone? Does Royal Canin SO dissolve the stone? (it’s a little cheaper than Hill’s). Assuming (praying!) the stone dissolves, do I need to keep her on a special diet the rest of her life or can I feed her a good quality food and add acidifiers(sp) like cranberry etc? I’m so overwhelmed! Anyone have better alternatives to dissolve the stone (and save money?!)? Thank you so much!

[Raelynn G]

In regards to using Royal Canin S/O it lead to the death of our beloved Doberman. He had gone in for bladder stones, struvite in composition and had 40 of them. The vet missed 2 that were logged in his urethra and after closing they x-rayed and saw the stones. They flushed back into the bladder and gave us the option of opening him up again, or we could; once he healed, use this very benign food from Royal Canin. What they don’t tell you is that you must give your dog a fiber additive or stool softners. The Royal Canin backed him up to the point that his colon was impacted on x-ray. He was straining to move his bowels and either herniated a disc or tore some tissue causing so much pain that he refused to eat. He never refused any food in his life and we tried for 8 months to get him to eat. Each time he would he would them go 2-3 days without eating. The vet was stumped and since he was not eating, we could not give him an anti-inflammatory. He started to lose a lot of weight and he went into hepatic lipodosis and eventually liver failure. He was barely 10 and in perfect health before the stones and feeding of that aweful food from Royal Canin. To those who say it is a good food brand, read the ingredients, they are terrible. The reps should inform people and we could have decided to do lithotripsy instead and my boy would still be with us. So yes, I hate that company and their crappy food.

• This reply was modified 6 years, 11 months ago by Raelynn G.

[Sue G]

Hi there
My little Maltese/Shih-Tzu was diagnosed with bladder stones in 2015 and was operated on and I was told she would have to be on a prescription diet for the rest of her life.
She was put on Hills Urinary care and it didn’t agree with her at all…I suggest you do some reading about it before you decide.
I changed her to Royal Canin Urinary SD and she hasn’t had a problem since.
I always add a little water to her meals
Hers were Struvite Crystal’s and I was told this diet dilutes the urine and helps prevent the growth of the crystals.
All good so far thank goodness…
Best of luck 🙂

[anonymous]

Per the search engine: /forums/search/bladder+stones/
See my posts
Also regarding prescription food:

More Nonsense from Holistic Vets about Commercial Therapeutic Diets

I have used Royal Canin SO for a dog for a dog with bladder stones with good results.
Zignature is a quality food, copy the ingredient list from Chewy and show your vet, maybe the dog could have that? Or, 1/2 and 1/2 with the prescription food? Check with your vet.
Whatever you feed, add water and maybe soft food, presoak kibble and add water.
Dogs that get bladder stones often have a genetic predisposition (struvite and calcium oxalate are the most common), not enough water is another contributing factor.
Has she had an x-ray/ultrasound to rule out bladder stones? Because, they can have more than one type of stones. This also. can result in recurrent urinary tract infections.
Add water to the kibble, and you can also presoak the kibble in water overnight in the fridge prior to serving.
Offer frequent bathroom breaks/opportunities to urinate, keep the bladder flushed. Stagnant conditions in the bladder are conductive to stone formation.
Don’t free feed, 2 or 3 small meals a day is better and always have fresh water available. Maybe add a little plain chicken broth (no onion) to the kibble.
A blocked urethra is a medical emergency and can result in surgery to save the dog’s life.
Did the vet talk to you about prescription meds for stubborn cases? Don’t confuse supplements with medication.
Work with your vet, prescription food and all, when the dog has been stable for 6 months to 1 year you can discuss diet changes.
Use the search engine here to see more threads on this topic.
This is not veterinary advice; consult your veterinarian.
Ps: You may find some helpful information here http://skeptvet.com/Blog/?s=urinary+tract+infection

[anonymous]

Copied from a previous post:
Also, if the dog is overweight, get the extra weight off, increase walks/exercise/activity.
Work closely with your vet, when the dog has been stable 6 months to 1 year then you can talk about diet changes.
“Dogs that get urinary tract infections and bladder stones tend to have a genetic predisposition, combine that with not enough water intake, not enough opportunities to urinate and you have a problem”.
“Whatever you decide to feed, add water to the kibble or canned food, even presoak and add water. Take out to urinate at least every 4 hours (every 2 hours is ideal) stagnant conditions in the bladder are conducive to bladder stone formation”.
“Always have fresh water available for the dog 24/7”.
“Supplements are crap, don’t waste your money unless your vet recommends something specific for your dog”.
Ps: You think the prescription food is expensive. Try emergency surgery for a blocked urethra.
Been there, done that.
Regarding cranberry: http://skeptvet.com/Blog/?s=cranberry
Also there are prescription meds for stubborn cases, talk to your vet.
Was an ultrasound done? Dogs can have more than one type of stone, such as calcium oxalate and struvite…that was the case with my dog that had reoccurring UTIs.
This is not veterinary advice; consult your veterinarian.
PS: Note recent question on struvite in comments: http://skeptvet.com/Blog/2016/09/science-based-veterinary-nutrition-success-stories/comment-page-1/#comment-121266
Good luck

[Bobby dog]

Hello Penny:
I recently went through a similar experience and spent a year researching horse rescue and adoption. Facebook and forums proved invaluable for me. I learned many things from the experiences posters shared on-line. I was also fortunate because my Vet has experience with rescue horses and gave me expert guidance throughout the process. IMO you’re on the right track looking into this health condition prior to making any decisions about adoption!

I personally would never feed or recommend a homemade recipe that was not formulated by a credentialed veterinary nutritionist (ACVN or PhD in small animal nutrition) for my cat or dog. Many recipes I have seen posted are lacking essential vitamins and minerals. Feeding a diet, homemade or commercial, that is not balanced or feeding a commercial food far below recommended amounts over a long period might exacerbate any health issue(s) known or unknown. Ensuring they get all there required vitamins and minerals especially when they have a known health condition is important. There are many recipes on the Internet that bloggers and Vets have posted. Ask the formulators if they are credentialed in small animal nutrition, my guess would be no for most of them.

If a Vet has recommended a special diet or even if you’re just interested in feeding a balanced homemade diet I second C4C’s suggestion to check out BalanceIT.com or petdiets.com. I use a product from BalanceIT for my pup, he loves his homemade meals. The recipes are simple to make and there are many options for budget friendly ingredients.

It sounds like a good start since you have her medical history and she already had the stones removed. I hope an adoption works out for you both!! 

Here’s a few sites you may find helpful:
https://www.vetmed.umn.edu/centers-programs/minnesota-urolith-center/recommendations
http://www.veterinarypartner.com/Content.plx?P=A&S=0&C=0&A=460

Struvite info:
https://www.vetmed.umn.edu/sites/vetmed.umn.edu/files/canine_struvite_uroliths.pdf

petdiets.com provides a free “ask the Veterinary Nutritionist” service:
https://petdiets.com/Ask-the-Nutritionist

[crazy4cats]

Penny-
Check out balanceit.com and/or petdiets.com. You can either request or formulate balanced recipes on these sites. They are run by vets who have specialized in nutrition.

As Aimee stated, struvite crystals in dogs frequently are caused by urinary tract infections. Has this dog been on antibiotics to rid her of infection? Typically, they are not food related. Making sure she gets plenty of water in her diet and opportunities to go potty are both important.

I have a cat that had a complete blockage due to Struvite crystals. I feed him Royal Canin Calm Rx kibble with a variety of regular canned food. He spent a couple of days in emergency clinic, but has been clear for a few years now! Apparently, male cats are very suseptible, but isn’t usually due to an infection.

Good luck, I really hope you can find a way to take this pup in! What kind of dog is she?

[anonymous]

I agree with Aimee, stones that don’t dissolve after antibiotic treatment are most likely not struvite.

I would insist on taking the dog to a vet of your choice for an exam and professional opinion before adopting (at your own expense)

Know what you are getting into, diet is only a very small part of t,he treatment that may be needed.

[aimee]

Hi Penny,

Unless your dog had the rather uncommon condition of struvite stones not related to an infection, diet isn’t the way to prevent recurrence. To prevent recurrence you need to seek out and address any medical problems that can make her prone to infection and then monitor urine for infection and treat appropriately.